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April 21, 2006

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[00:57:34] <mac_> yop
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[01:52:42] <alect> hey eblot
[01:52:52] <eblot> hi
[01:54:02] <eblot> any issue w/ my last, very late commit?
[01:54:44] <alect> haven't updated yet, why do you ask?
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[01:56:45] <eblot> since I'm off this week end, this was a pretty urgent issue, I've committed it a 3:00 am, and I'm not sure it did not break something (although I ran the test suite) ;-))
[01:57:07] <alect> ah :)
[01:57:49] <eblot> I'll try to run real tests this week end, but I won't be able to connect to the Internet (48h w/o the Net, arggg ;-))
[01:59:22] <eblot> btw, there are two non-regression tests that did not pass: test_milestone_add_utf8_ok and test_implicit_lossless but they are not related with the notification. Do you get the same issues ?
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[02:02:47] <HandyAndE> alect: is there a definitive list of library dep. versions that are tested?
[02:02:50] <HandyAndE> alect: I can try that...
[02:03:02] <HandyAndE> alect: it must be related to the python I suppose, if standalone works
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[02:08:53] <alect> eblot!
[02:09:18] <alect> ande: only what's documented on the wiki
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[02:20:43] <HandyAndE> alect: k
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[03:11:30] <tim|mac> is there anyone here who can help me with trac-post-commit-hook?
[03:13:24] <tim|mac> I'm getting an error and I don't know where to start searching for the solution
[03:13:26] <tim|mac> http://pastebin.com/672980
[03:19:40] <dna> wron svn reprository path
[03:19:43] <dna> wrong
[03:21:00] <tim|mac> indeed, thx :)
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[03:47:50] <tuxipuxi> i get "PythonHandler trac.web.modpython_frontend: DatabaseError: file is encrypted or is not a database" after hot-copying a trac project and a trac project with it. anybody an idea?
[03:49:21] <dna> "DatabaseError: file is encrypted or is not a database" <== if i remember right it was a versions conflict between sqlite 2 and 3
[03:49:44] <dna> there a many tickets about that
[03:49:58] <tuxipuxi> do you also remember if it can be solved or if i'm screwed?
[03:50:07] <dna> it can
[03:53:13] <tuxipuxi> dna: hm can't find any tickets with (parts) of that error message in it
[03:54:26] <dna> for example: http://projects.edgewall.com/trac/ticket/2585
[03:55:18] <tuxipuxi> oh have only searched the opened tickets, thanks dna
[04:09:00] <HandyAndE> tuxipuxi: I have issues with the webfrontend too
[04:09:08] <HandyAndE> tuxipuxi: works if I use tracd which is annoying
[04:10:07] <tuxipuxi> HandyAndE: the problem indeed was related to sqlite2 -> sqlite3 on my side
[04:24:31] <HandyAndE> tuxipuxi: cool - wish I could figure our what mine is
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[05:26:32] <alect> hullo
[05:27:07] * muness has joined #trac
[05:27:59] <alect> hey muness
[05:28:30] <muness> hi alec
[05:28:36] <muness> how goes it?
[05:28:47] <alect> not too bad, you?
[05:28:52] <alect> four day weekend! woot!
[05:29:01] <muness> four days?!
[05:29:29] <alect> yeah, public holiday on tuesday and i took monday off
[05:29:31] <alect> eeeexcellent
[05:29:50] <muness> I am doing well enough. today I fight with an ugly schema and figure out how we can copy data from production to our test environment. Joy. ;)
[05:30:23] <alect> heh
[05:30:33] <muness> I need a long weekend where I don't have classes to prep for or contracting to do. That'd be heaven.
[05:30:45] <muness> So I can play with Trac!
[05:30:50] <alect> :)
[05:30:55] <alect> mmm trac
[05:31:14] <alect> i just made an acronyms plugin
[05:31:20] <muness> ooh
[05:31:49] <alect> http://trac-hacks.org/wiki/AcronymDefinitions
[05:31:50] <alect> many
[05:31:55] <alect> i stole them all mwuahah
[05:32:33] <alect> ooh excel mime viewer
[05:33:53] <muness> ?
[05:34:06] <alect> a plugin on trachacks
[05:34:45] <muness> demo!
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[05:35:00] <alect> we need a screenshot :)
[05:35:06] <muness> Indeed!
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[05:38:21] <muness> alect: because I am a one trick sort of guy, I think acronyms should be tag based!
[05:38:29] <muness> or optionally so rather.
[05:38:38] <alect> that does not suprise me ;)
[05:38:45] <muness> :)
[05:38:57] <alect> how would you define them though?
[05:38:59] <alect> a page per acronym?
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[05:39:46] <muness> Yes.
[05:39:48] <muness> http://muness.textdriven.com/trac/tags/Terms
[05:40:21] <muness> Maybe save wikis tagged to the acronym table automagically
[05:40:22] <alect> i did think of adding auto-tag linking to the wiki
[05:40:33] <alect> for every tag, not just acronyms
[05:40:40] <alect> but i think it might be a little intense
[05:40:50] <muness> via the tag interception mechanism
[05:41:09] <alect> well you could do it with the current system
[05:41:20] <alect> although with the tag interception you could certainly make it quick
[05:41:36] <alect> only update the tag link pattern when tags change
[05:41:45] <muness> :)
[05:42:28] <muness> auto-tag linking?
[05:42:51] <muness> any time a tag is mentioned in the wiki text, link it?
[05:42:57] <alect> yeah
[05:42:58] <muness> a la camel case linking?
[05:43:10] <alect> yeah, same deal as the acronyms
[05:43:24] <alect> should put that in as an idea page :)
[05:43:50] <muness> on it...
[05:44:20] <alect> i might do some 0.5 hacking over the long weekend. mmm time off
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[05:45:58] <muness> that'd be cool.
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[05:46:13] <muness> I should be online a lot if you want to toss ideas back and forth.
[05:46:32] <muness> Hopefully one day I'll start committing code too. ;)
[05:48:08] <mac_> Anyone from Edgewall here ? I'm trying to get in touch for some custom Trac developments through their Web form, with no result.
[05:48:39] <muness> there's your cue, Alec!
[05:48:43] <alect> nobody from edgewall, but a few devs are here
[05:48:46] <alect> haha :)
[05:48:50] <alect> easy tiger
[05:49:25] <mac_> I cannot deal directly with individuals, I need to work with a corporate
[05:49:49] <alect> jonas, who comes in here sometimes, is an edgewall guy
[05:49:53] <alect> jborg is his nick
[05:49:58] <mac_> thx
[05:50:13] <mac_> but they don't seem responsive, so it's not really a good start for a cooperation with them :(
[05:50:33] <alect> what are you after, or is it hush hush?
[05:50:52] <mac_> mostly way to makes management of multiple projects easier
[05:51:00] <mac_> like cross-projects reporting...
[05:51:14] <mac_> (could be interesting for the "community" as well)
[05:51:48] <muness> multiple projects on multiple Trac instances?
[05:51:52] <mac_> and dependencies within the Tickets... this one is *really* missing
[05:52:43] <mac_> mostly on the same instance for now (but we'll have projects living on different servers as well)
[05:52:52] <alect> dependencies are possible in the workflow branch
[05:52:57] <alect> have you looked at drproject?
[05:53:07] <mac_> nope
[05:54:05] <mac_> forks are usually not very good for corporates - you need to be reasonably sure that the project will still exist and be maintained in 5-10 years from now
[05:54:45] * mac_ would love to see support for several Wiki syntaxes as well... we're used to Mediawiki here, and it will be a mess to convert everyone to Trac's Wiki syntax
[05:55:10] <mac_> that kind of "small" developments...
[05:55:38] <muness> Mind if Log these somewhere?
[05:55:45] <mac_> sure not
[05:55:51] * s0undt3ch has a plug that mimics MediaWiki templates ;)
[05:56:36] <mac_> s0undt3ch plugs are cool... but I'm really looking for a turnkey solution
[05:56:50] <mac_> because some day your plug will not work any more because of X or Y
[05:57:22] <muness> plugins are pretty much turnkey now for a given release branch. trac itself is a set of core plugins
[05:57:39] <mac_> yes, but will they still work in 5 years ?
[05:57:53] <mac_> (with newer releases of Trac I mean)
[05:58:04] <muness> I see your point.
[05:58:12] <alect> as opposed to what though? core support for alternate syntaxes?
[05:58:24] <alect> i don't think that will ever happen
[05:59:05] <mac_> maybe not... but we'd be ready to pay for that (note that this was the last item in my list - I know there is not much value added there for Trac, even if there is a LOT of added value for users)
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[06:00:08] <muness> mac_: the core will probably stay small and not accept this. It's API is fairly stable, so carefully designed plugins *should* work. And people may maintain them.
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[06:00:55] <muness> that's my impression anyway.
[06:01:04] <mac_> muness I can understand this... but it's a choice which can have some nasty consequences, like most arbitrary choices.
[06:02:54] <alect> it's not really arbitrary
[06:03:02] <mac_> the choice of the Wiki syntax ?
[06:03:32] <alect> i meant, not supporting random cruft in the core
[06:03:38] <mac_> okokok
[06:03:45] <alect> the wiki syntax was based off moinmoin
[06:03:59] <alect> i'm not sure whether that was arbitrary or not :)
[06:05:28] <muness> mac_: is trac your preferred choice for this stuff?
[06:05:39] <muness> are there other tools that come close?
[06:05:46] <mac_> muness for our internal project management you mean ?
[06:06:14] <muness> Yeah. Why are you looking to get this stuff into Trac, specifically?
[06:06:42] <mac_> I'm looking for a tool that would suit the need of a team of +/- 10 developers, plus a few external companies
[06:06:48] <mac_> to manage +/- 20 projects
[06:06:53] <mac_> and Trac is on the shortlist
[06:07:19] <mac_> with dotproject and Jira
[06:07:33] <muness> It's my preferred tool, by far, but I haven't really looked at other options once I found it...
[06:09:28] <muness> dotproject isn't even self-hosting, it seems.
[06:10:09] <mac_> well... so what ? :)
[06:10:32] <mac_> Perl is not written in Perl :P
[06:10:42] <muness> eh, for a project management tool, I'd expect it to be self-hosting.
[06:10:56] <muness> that's more like svn using cvs for their repo.
[06:11:23] <muness> :)
[06:11:29] <mac_> no, honestly it's not part of what I would expect
[06:12:08] <muness> fair enough...
[06:16:16] <HandyAndE> alect: looks like a pHP5 issue
[06:16:21] <cmlenz> if you need the commercial support and a more advanced ticket system, I think you should go with jira...
[06:16:26] <HandyAndE> alect: http://threebit.net/mail-archive/trac/msg00981.html
[06:17:04] <alect> mmm, php might drag in another version of sqlite perhaps
[06:18:00] <HandyAndE> it has sqlite3 too, I know - cos that is what I installed ;)
[06:19:51] <alect> is it the same version?
[06:20:07] <muness> HandyAndE: does it work if you remove the php so?
[06:20:21] <alect> php bundles sqlite it seems
[06:20:40] <HandyAndE> muness: yes
[06:20:45] <HandyAndE> alect: php5-slite is not installed
[06:20:50] <HandyAndE> but pear PDO_SQLITE
[06:20:51] <HandyAndE> is
[06:20:56] <HandyAndE> and if I uninstall it it works
[06:21:00] <HandyAndE> so it is PDO_SQLITE!!!
[06:21:13] <alect> heh
[06:27:48] <HandyAndE> not helping though, cos I _really_ need that installed
[06:27:52] <HandyAndE> this sucks!
[06:27:59] <HandyAndE> but at least it is not trac's fault!
[06:28:05] <alect> i'd find what version it uses
[06:28:29] <alect> and install it, then relink pysqlite against that version
[06:30:50] <HandyAndE> cunning
[06:35:12] <alect> or rebuild it using your current version :)
[06:35:17] <alect> if possible...
[06:35:44] <HandyAndE> .deb
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[06:51:07] <HandyAndE> can I disabled the "Browse Source" with something like: trac.versioncontrol.browser = disabled
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[06:59:18] <cmlenz> trac.versioncontrol.web_ui.browser
[06:59:24] <cmlenz> actually
[06:59:32] <cmlenz> trac.versioncontrol.web_ui.browser.* = disabled
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[07:08:21] <spike> hi there
[07:08:33] <HandyAndE> cmlenz: thanks, but that did not work
[07:09:21] <spike> I was looking at the roadmap, and I was wondering if there's any interest to expand trac a bit more toward a ticketing system
[07:09:30] <HandyAndE> cmlenz: oops - sorry, typo
[07:09:40] <spike> namely I'd love to see an email-gw, like the RT or roundup one
[07:10:29] <alect> like this: http://trac-hacks.org/wiki/EmailtoTracScript ?
[07:10:51] <alect> there are some tickets related to the nosy list from roundup
[07:12:59] <spike> alect: yeah, lovely, that's what I was talking about
[07:13:02] <spike> alect: is it stable?
[07:13:17] <alect> seems to get a lot of use, and the devs are very responsive
[07:13:21] <spike> I dont need RT, just a more comfortable way to interact with trac, ie mail
[07:13:23] <alect> i've not used it myself though
[07:13:31] <spike> I see, well, I'll definitely try it out
[07:14:19] <spike> with trac set to send emails for ticket mods and stuff to an ML you can almost do without the web interface, which saves a lot of time in the log run imho
[07:14:31] <spike> at least for the way I'm used to work (mostly in terminals)
[07:14:53] <alect> that script can only create tickets at the moment, not update them
[07:14:58] <alect> there's a ticket open for it though
[07:15:08] <alect> and they are planning on implementing it
[07:15:09] * mac_ would prefer to be able to do everything from the Web interface before adding Yet Another Interface
[07:17:40] <spike> mac_: why would you keep useful things on hold but for a "sense of danger" or how you want to call it
[07:18:26] <mac_> To focus on "even more useful things" ? :) (but then what is useful for you is maybe not useful for me)
[07:19:09] <spike> exactly
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[07:22:38] <spike> alect: does it happen you know of a plugin exposing trac data via xml-rpc?
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[07:23:04] <spike> so I can do like trac-client roadmap, and get some text withe the milestones and everything
[07:23:07] <alect> http://trac-hacks.org/wiki/XmlRpcPlugin
[07:23:32] <alect> it doesn't expose anything roadmap related yet though, unfortunately
[07:24:10] <alect> well, except for the actual milestone objects
[07:24:24] <alect> but you can fetch the tickets for a milestone via a query
[07:24:28] <alect> which is exposed
[07:24:46] <alect> if you register on trac-hacks you can see all the procedures here http://trac-hacks.org/xmlrpc
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[07:29:11] <alect> if you write some decent management scripts using that plugin, it'd be cool if you added a new hack to trachacks :)
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[07:43:03] <spike> alect: if I have time to write anything atm I'd help with roadmap and timeline exposition, which I need indeed. then well, goal is a trac-client
[07:43:28] <spike> another thing, I'm reading up on VersioningSystemBackend, and I'm not sure I get it
[07:43:42] <spike> you still need svn even if you use a different backend?
[07:44:18] <TovAre> Hi, how do I insert html pointing to a web-applicatio in Trac? I?ve tried an IFRAME but it using the {{{ #!html }}} style insertion, but it seems to be filtered away.
[07:44:35] <alect> spike: not with trunk
[07:45:08] <spike> alect: oh, so in trunk they're not tighten together anymore?
[07:45:37] <alect> tovare: i'd modify your site_header.cs or site_footer.cs
[07:45:41] <alect> nope
[07:45:47] <spike> cool
[07:45:49] <alect> you can even use "none" as the repo type
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[07:46:32] <muness> re the earlier discussion on a trac-client, can't one do that now using python? Isn't that how tests and so on work?
[07:47:00] <alect> only with local access to the trac env
[07:47:01] <spike> muness: remotely?
[07:47:10] <TovAre> alect, I?m running in a hosted enviroment (cvsdude). I need to integrate functionality like sending an email in Trac, inserting a web-application using an iframe is a pretty straight forway way to do it.
[07:49:16] <alect> well, iframe is not one of the safe tags, so you need to find an alternative
[07:49:41] <pacopablo> mac_: depending on how much work you want to do personally, you can make custom cross instance reports using postgresql and the PgSchemaPatch on trac-hacks.org
[07:50:06] <pacopablo> mac_: though it's not really a full multi-project management interface or anything
[07:50:52] <pacopablo> alect: I'll have to figure out what trackbacks realyl are, but a good idea
[07:50:58] <alect> heh
[07:51:03] <alect> yeah, i'm not quite sure myself :)
[07:51:15] <pacopablo> alect: I also need to figure out a way to allow comments on a post
[07:51:18] <mac_> pacopablo thx, that's what I figured out... but even migrating from sqlite to postgresql doesn't look like somthing trivial (or did I miss the right script ?)
[07:51:22] <alect> i don't really read blogs much
[07:51:30] <pacopablo> mac_: it's not that hard
[07:51:36] <alect> paco: yeah...i'm using AddComment at the moment
[07:51:49] <pacopablo> mac_: dump the sql from sqlite, import it into pg
[07:51:50] <TovAre> alect, is loading an attached Java applet considered safe?
[07:52:04] <TovAre> (I could sign it and use it to send an email)
[07:52:16] <pacopablo> I think you may have to munge a little in order for it to get into the right schema, but not bad
[07:52:29] <alect> tovare: i don't know whether that would work or not
[07:52:31] <pacopablo> if you want, I've got a script that migates between them, though it's a bit custom
[07:52:55] <pacopablo> alect: nothing personal, but I don't really like AddComment :)
[07:52:56] <mac_> pacopablo I'll eventually do that - but I definitely have some work on my own projects and not much time on the project management system
[07:53:29] * mac_ busy buying time with @#! marketing
[07:53:39] <pacopablo> alect: Don't like how it updates the actual wiki page
[07:53:55] <alect> no, it's not ideal
[07:54:01] <pacopablo> especially since tags can't be versioned yet
[07:54:34] <alect> cmlenz didn't seem amenable to a timelin crud table
[07:54:51] <alect> and i don't think it's worth adding a table just for tag history
[07:54:59] <pacopablo> it's a plugin, right? :)
[07:55:10] <pacopablo> well, maybe some other way or something
[07:55:26] <cmlenz> I don't see what's wrong with adding a table for tag history
[07:55:27] <alect> i think a timeline crud table would be very useful personally
[07:55:36] <pacopablo> but it would seem that with the tag plugin, the tags become part of the wiki history
[07:55:37] <alect> attachment additions, deletions, page deletes
[07:56:40] <alect> cmlenz: just seems like overkill :)
[07:57:08] <alect> paco: there's no history at all, just an association with the page name
[07:57:22] <alect> the old one used to because the tags were applied via a macro
[07:58:52] <pacopablo> alect: right, I'm saying that it *should* be part of the page history
[07:59:18] <alect> yeah
[07:59:41] <alect> btw, if you have any cool ideas, add a page here: http://muness.textdriven.com/trac/tags/%27idea%27
[07:59:47] <alect> tag it with "tags, idea"
[08:00:04] <alect> i'll add TagVersioning
[08:00:10] <pacopablo> cool
[08:02:29] <alect> or i would, if it wasn't as slow as molasses
[08:02:43] <pacopablo> hehe
[08:03:56] <alect> and TagHistory too
[08:06:17] <alect> zzzz
[08:07:46] * tiagovaz has quit IRC
[08:08:02] <TovAre> Does anyone have any experience with Trac Gantt-plugin? It?s seems very desirable if it works?
[08:08:39] <muness> alect: muness.textdriven.com is running via cgi, probably why it's so slow.
[08:08:49] <alect> ah :)
[08:08:55] <pacopablo> muness: ugh, why?
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[08:10:39] <muness> textdrive hell
[08:10:43] <muness> they're a pain.
[08:10:46] <pacopablo> ahh
[08:12:39] <muness> I am running my own local install of Trac because I got tired of how long it took them to update to current stable.
[08:18:40] <alect> we should have a "random" contextual tag plugin
[08:18:49] <alect> randomly picks words out of a dictionary and tags pages with them
[08:19:14] <pacopablo> why?
[08:19:25] <pacopablo> beyibd the wtf? factor
[08:19:30] <pacopablo> er, beyond
[08:19:45] <alect> wtf factor is pretty much it
[08:19:50] <pacopablo> hehe
[08:22:05] <muness> tag of the day plugin.
[08:22:14] * mac_ is now known as `mac_
[08:22:29] <muness> that would be less wtf and more i am such a geek
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[08:22:48] <mofo> morning to all
[08:22:49] <alect> heh
[08:22:52] <alect> yo mofo
[08:23:09] <mofo> howdy alect
[08:23:18] <alect> weee reverse alliteration
[08:23:52] <mofo> ;)
[08:26:21] <pacopablo> w00t!
[08:26:31] <pacopablo> new method for using stan as a templating language :)
[08:26:47] <pacopablo> it's a plugin -- TracIStan :)
[08:27:02] <pacopablo> I figured that AfTracIStan was a bit much
[08:27:07] <alect> hahaha
[08:27:16] <alect> nice
[08:27:49] <pacopablo> alect: does the new hack form work now?
[08:28:09] <alect> yes, although it borks quotes and ampersand
[08:28:18] <pacopablo> k
[08:28:24] <alect> i think i'd need to make it into its own request handler to get around that
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[08:35:26] <mofo> how people can reply in tBlog
[08:35:28] <mofo> ?
[08:36:01] <mofo> by now the can post, then to put a comment the need to go to "read post"
[08:36:06] <mofo> and modify there the page
[08:36:14] <mofo> thats the only way ?
[08:36:16] <alect> you can use the addcomment macro as a work around
[08:36:32] <mofo> ok Ithank you
[08:36:57] <cmlenz> IThankYouProvider
[08:37:09] * pacopablo grumbles about new hack munging double quotes
[08:37:31] <alect> hehe
[08:37:40] * i