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August 24, 2008

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[01:51:40] <evil_twin> New news from t.e.o: SeaChange/WhatUsersWant edited <http://trac.edgewall.org/wiki/SeaChange/WhatUsersWant?version=50>
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[02:09:10] <m4rku5> hey - where can i find that build status plugin used on t.e.o ?
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[02:20:05] <m4rku5> aaah i think i found it ;D
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[02:45:50] <]2ge[> hi all
[02:46:08] <]2ge[> I used trac 0.10 for 1 year maybe, now I upgraded to 0.11.1 and I have 500 internal server error
[02:46:27] <]2ge[> I make a new bug report, nobody has answered. Is here some guru for trac please ?
[02:46:38] <]2ge[> my issue is this: http://trac.edgewall.org/ticket/7537
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[02:53:17] <evil_twin> New news from t.e.o: SeaChange/WhatUsersWant edited <http://trac.edgewall.org/wiki/SeaChange/WhatUsersWant?version=51>
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[03:38:10] <FlaPer87> hey guys, is there a Macro for Math ?
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[03:54:22] <FlaPer87> if i installed trac with python2.4. how can i upgrade the python version?
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[05:55:52] <osimons> ]2ge[: hmm. if your webserver log is empty since 24.07, i suspect it may not be the right log... look in the main lighttpd log, maybe it ended up there?
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[08:34:48] <Aryko> Hello, I've downloaded a theme from http://trac-hacks.org/wiki/CrystalxTheme and I'm having a hard time trying to install it. The .zip archive and the unziped folders are both under my trac project template's folder and I've added the lines as specified on http://trac-hacks.org/wiki/CrystalxTheme in my project's trac.ini
[08:35:17] <Aryko> Am I missing something? The documentation I found http://trac.edgewall.org/wiki/TracInterfaceCustomization is not very explicit on templates
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[08:54:01] <HenrikV> can AccountManagerPlugin be used when running tracd ?
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[11:23:12] <coderanger> HenrikV: Yes
[11:24:40] <HenrikV> coderange, cool. I don't entirely grok the explanation. Is it supposed to support standalone user registration, or do I need support from the webserver?
[11:25:01] <coderanger> user registration is orthogonal from authentication
[11:25:27] <coderanger> you could do registration in acctmgr and authn in the server as long as they both point at the same file
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[12:26:21] <Eloff> I'm using tracd, and I notice that on large attachment uploads I get "connection interrupted" error
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[12:27:12] <evil_twin> New news from t.e.o: Ticket #7559 (expand_dir.js is buggy on table layouts) created <http://trac.edgewall.org/ticket/7559>
[12:27:41] <Eloff> hmm, actually it may not be tracd's fault, could be nginx
[12:27:49] <Eloff> nginx is reverse proxying to trac
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[13:39:49] <thatch> Eloff: how large is large? 2gb+?
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[15:49:26] <roh> hey there.. just thinking..any change i am not the only one who would have use for a 'ipkg feed renderer' ?
[15:50:05] <roh> something like packages.debian.org, which is generic, means one only adds http-uris, it fetches the package-listings with metadata and does a nice render of it...
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[16:23:58] <coderanger> roh: Wrong channel?
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[16:41:27] <m_stone> coderanger: 'evening.
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[16:51:22] <arooni________a> hey everyone
[16:51:27] <arooni________a> how do i edit 10 tickets at once?
[16:52:55] <elb> the short answer is, you don't
[16:53:03] <arooni________a> what is the long answer
[16:53:08] <arooni________a> is there a plugin for this?
[16:53:10] <elb> whether or not there's another solution to your problem depends on what you're trying to do
[16:54:24] <arooni________a> ok here's what i want to do: i have 10 tickets that are assigned to foo; i want to assign them to bar; in addition, i would also like to update the component that these 10 tickets belong to
[16:56:13] <m_stone> arooni________a: are there any special requirements on how you explain your desired change to trac?
[16:56:35] * arooni________a is now known as arooni
[16:56:47] <arooni> m_stone, i don't follow
[16:57:32] <m_stone> arooni: trac has a web-ui, a plugin system, a database, and an xml-rpc interface.
[16:57:50] <m_stone> arooni: all of these could, conceivably, be used to tell trac to update your tickets.
[16:57:57] <arooni> ah ok
[16:58:05] <arooni> i was hoping to do it thru webui
[16:59:39] <m_stone> arooni: in that case, for only 10 tickets, it will certainly be fastest to commit the change by hand to each ticket.
[16:59:51] <arooni> i thought there was a multi select plugin
[17:00:52] <m_stone> arooni: there might be. however, it'll take you longer to find it and to install it than to update those tickets. :)
[17:01:20] <arooni> hmmm ok
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[17:01:31] <arooni> this is an exercise i wont be donig just once
[17:01:40] <m_stone> ah hah. :)
[17:04:56] <m_stone> arooni: see http://trac.edgewall.org/ticket/525, http://trac-hacks.org/wiki/BatchModifyPlugin, and http://trac.edgewall.org/wiki/TracDev/DatabaseSchema
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[17:06:06] <arooni> m_stone, thanks very much
[17:06:18] <m_stone> arooni: you're very welcome.
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[17:16:47] <coderanger> m_stone: yo
[17:16:57] <coderanger> arooni: BatchMofidy plugin on trac-hacks
[17:17:06] <arooni> coderanger, thanks i'm on it ;p
[17:17:21] <arooni> or rather you are; you seem to write a lot of plugins
[17:17:42] <coderanger> I didn't actually make that one, but yes
[17:18:04] <m_stone> coderanger: I just thought I'd wander by and say hello.
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[17:18:38] <m_stone> coderanger: (I was admiring the recent pocoo-projects updates and thought of you.)
[17:20:27] <coderanger> heh
[17:22:24] <JerMe> Can anyone take a look at the error at: http://abr.jtechwebsystems.com/ and suggest a fix? I recently upgraded from .10 to .11
[17:22:46] <m_stone> coderanger: as you can see, your silly trac_custom table is making me do some rather evil joins...: http://pastebin.be/13358
[17:23:58] <m_stone> though I suppose you'll just tell me that I ought to use the Workflow plugin and be done with it. :)
[17:24:11] <coderanger> m_stone: That and the mastertickets plugin
[17:24:35] <coderanger> there is actually a thread on the Trac ML right now about using keywords for ticket relations
[17:24:45] <coderanger> and I keep trying to explain why this is a bad idea :P
[17:24:56] <coderanger> JerMe: Upgrade acctmgr
[17:25:11] <coderanger> in fact check all your plugins to see if 0.11 versions are available
[17:25:41] <m_stone> coderanger: pointer to thread?
[17:26:16] <coderanger> http://groups.google.com/group/trac-users/browse_thread/thread/50b2471f24a36fab
[17:26:20] <m_stone> coderanger: I have some sense of why it's a bad idea, but it feels so much easier to set up than new UI elements...
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[17:26:35] <coderanger> m_stone: mastertickets is already installed
[17:26:56] <coderanger> just make a ticket for "Blocking 8.2.0" and set any needed tickets to block it
[17:27:04] <coderanger> or I guess the ticket would be "Release 8.2.0"
[17:28:07] <m_stone> coderanger: w/ the inevitable non-readability that results? :)
[17:28:14] <coderanger> Hmm??
[17:28:19] <coderanger> er -?
[17:28:26] <m_stone> coderanger: we discussed it when we last spoke -- I even filed a bug for you. :)
[17:28:56] <m_stone> http://trac-hacks.org/ticket/3339
[17:29:10] <coderanger> ahh yes
[17:29:33] * coderanger checks to see how complex the fix will be
[17:30:18] <m_stone> coderanger: the milestone field is partially but not fully adequate for my purposes. basically, we see a lot of '? -> + or -' workflows for reviews, blockerness, etc.
[17:30:38] <m_stone> coderanger: for the time being, we've simulated that w/ keywords, as you've seen.
[17:30:38] <coderanger> right, but I would use actual workflow states for that
[17:30:53] <m_stone> coderanger: even though there can be multiple outstanding questions?
[17:31:01] <coderanger> Then you can even get nice pretty bar graphs
[17:31:06] <m_stone> e.g. a ticket which needs review _and_ which we're considering slipping?
[17:31:37] <coderanger> m_stone: hmm, multiple/heirarchical states is a tricky one
[17:31:39] <m_stone> how might I represent that w/ a workflow?
[17:32:00] <m_stone> coderanger: i.e. it's regular to see a r? blocks?:8.2.0 ticket.
[17:32:54] <coderanger> given that the "considering slipping" is largely orthogonal to the workflow, given that it can happen in any state, I would leave that as a keyword perhaps?
[17:33:28] <m_stone> coderanger: perhaps. my observation was simply that this feels like a ui control.
[17:33:28] <coderanger> Having mutliple ticket blocker categories might also be helpful, having "blocks" and "maybe blocks"
[17:33:57] <m_stone> i.e. a control that explicitly represents "incomplete knowledge" of some quality of the ticket.
[17:34:27] <m_stone> coderanger: that would be one way to think about it.
[17:34:36] <coderanger> There are other ways it could be done, I would look at it as a patching problem
[17:34:37] <m_stone> coderanger: another would be to implement several parallel state machines.
[17:34:48] <coderanger> someone can suggest a patch (set of ticket changes) without actually applying them
[17:34:59] <m_stone> say a bit more please.
[17:35:35] <coderanger> so the question of slipping a ticket would be a patch like "-milestone: 8.2.0 \n +milestone: 8.2.1"
[17:36:01] <m_stone> mmm, cute.
[17:36:17] <coderanger> by grouping those patches into views (a la darcs) you can represent multiple superpositions of the ticket db
[17:36:53] <m_stone> that last part didn't make sense. could use different words to say the same thing or give an example?
[17:38:14] <coderanger> basically the idea boils down to branching tickets. there would be some canonical tip branch that represents the true state of the ticket db, but you could view feature or personal branches of it as well
[17:38:29] <m_stone> you seem to be proposing that I regard the trac db as darcs patchset such that every patch has a "?+-' attached to it.
[17:38:52] <coderanger> along with some kind of overlay to show when the ticket you are looking at has changes in other branches
[17:39:25] <coderanger> hmm, not sure if I like this, might get too hard to keep people on the same page
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[17:39:46] <m_stone> coderanger: likely it would work well for some people (like me) and less well for others (like kim) :)
[17:40:06] <coderanger> mayhaps a slider for each field indicating level of confidence in its current value
[17:40:30] <coderanger> either as a single value or as some kind of weighted average of individual votes
[17:40:39] <JerMe> coderanger: thanks for the answer.. I actually tried that earlier but run into another error
[17:41:06] * m_stone is being overwhelmed by visions of functors.
[17:41:18] <coderanger> different users would probably have different weights or something, the lead developer doubting the value of the milestone means a lot more than some random anonymous user
[17:41:42] <m_stone> coderanger: that's one decent way to think about it; however, I think a better one is to attach a small state machine to each field.
[17:42:07] <JerMe> when I run 'easy_install http://trac-hacks.org/svn/accountmanagerplugin/trunk/' as root (per the instruction for AccountManager plugin), I get an error about "log.warn("unrecognized .svn/entries format in %s", dirname) NameError: global name 'log' is not defined"
[17:42:31] <m_stone> coderanger: simple fields like severity have a well-connected transition graph.
[17:42:40] <m_stone> coderanger: i.e. all transitions between states are possible.
[17:43:05] <coderanger> m_stone: If we are going the stateful route I would rather see tickets allowed to be in multiple states, possibly with a hierarchical component
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[17:43:35] <coderanger> that seems far more intuitive
[17:43:38] <m_stone> coderanger: I was thinking about hierarchical components recently for different reasons.
[17:43:58] <m_stone> coderanger: joe seems to want them so that people who only vaguely understand the layout of the system can still get someone plausible assigned to a ticket.
[17:44:52] <m_stone> i.e. so that I can assign to 'control panel' and the 'sugar' people get notified.
[17:45:16] <coderanger> that is more a notification issue than a ticket one
[17:45:22] <coderanger> something that is known to need a lot of work
[17:45:52] <coderanger> the sugar team should be able to subscribe to notifications from new tickets matching component=control panel
[17:46:13] <m_stone> coderanger: anyone working on it?
[17:46:40] * m_stone has casually thought about spending occasional weekends on trac...
[17:46:53] <coderanger> There is a plugin (announcerplugin) that does a lot of what will probably end up in core
[17:47:04] <coderanger> not at the level of code, but the design is very close
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[17:48:14] * m_stone smiles as he thinks about Bayesian-Trac
[17:48:29] <m_stone> it's so silly but so humorous at the same time!
[17:49:37] <coderanger> heh
[17:50:19] <m_stone> coderanger: tangential citation that this conversation reminded me of: http://okmij.org/ftp/Computation/Continuations.html#shift-cgi
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[18:10:59] <coderanger> mmm, stateful parsing in closures
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[18:16:41] <m_stone> coderanger: it's rather cute, isn't it?
[18:17:01] <coderanger> it would help if python closures weren't littered with [0]
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[18:19:00] <m_stone> coderanger: so where is the workflow state actually stored in the DB schema?
[18:19:08] <coderanger> the state field
[18:19:27] <m_stone> that would make sense. I take it http://trac.edgewall.org/wiki/TracDev/DatabaseSchema is out of sync?
[18:19:59] <coderanger> shouldn't be, I don't think we have changed the schema in a while
[18:20:12] <retracile> state, aka status
[18:20:20] <coderanger> ah, yes, sorry
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[18:21:28] <lstrojny> Hello
[18:21:38] <lstrojny> I've installed trac under fcgi
[18:21:45] <m_stone> retracile: thanks.
[18:21:53] <lstrojny> is there a way to get nicer links without index.fcgi in the URL?
[18:22:14] <coderanger> Don't install the stupid way
[18:22:17] <coderanger> @tracdoc
[18:22:17] <evil_twin> coderanger: "tracdoc" is https://coderanger.net/~coderanger/tracdoc/install/index.html
[18:22:18] <m_stone> lstrojny: mod_rewrite?
[18:22:22] <coderanger> No
[18:22:35] <coderanger> Use a scriptalias, don't install like a normal cgi script
[18:23:11] <m_stone> coderanger: you've been rather busy w/ sphinx, it seems.
[18:23:27] <lstrojny> ScriptAlias is not allowed in a .htaccess file. There is no other way?
[18:23:41] * retracile is now known as retracile_
[18:23:45] <coderanger> m_stone: That was a PoC I did a while ago
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[18:26:20] <m_stone> coderanger: well, I think I'm off for this part of the evening. until next time, O Gruff One. :)
[18:26:27] <coderanger> laters
[18:26:43] <coderanger> I will install the nicer UI mastertickets when it is done shortly
[18:27:56] <m_stone> coderanger: that's sweet of you; thanks!
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[19:00:08] <coderanger> I love it when things are easier than I expect
[19:07:57] <ErikRose> How the heck do you install the FootNote macro?
[19:08:12] <coderanger> Like any other plugin
[19:08:19] <ErikRose> I can get a Python module out of it. Do I throw it in an env's wiki-macro's folder?
[19:08:33] <coderanger> wiki-macros is dead in >= 0.11
[19:08:49] <ErikRose> I took a guess, put it in the plugins folder, and put footnotemacro.* = enabled in the [components] section of the ini.
[19:08:50] <coderanger> a "macro" is just a plugin that provides one of more macros
[19:08:55] <ErikRose> No dice.
[19:10:03] <coderanger> hah, guess I never updated the docs when I did the port
[19:10:24] <coderanger> but yes, build an egg as normal and it should work
[19:10:48] <ErikRose> Do I have the ini line right?
[19:11:10] <coderanger> Yes, though if you install to the env's plugins/ folder it isn't needed
[19:11:30] <ErikRose> Hmm. *tries to figure out what's wrong*
[19:11:45] <coderanger> check the log to make sure it is loading
[19:11:49] <coderanger> @logging
[19:11:49] <ErikRose> k
[19:11:50] <evil_twin> coderanger: "logging" is http://trac.edgewall.org/wiki/TracLogging <-- Enable debug logging to file, ensure your environments log/ directory is writeable by your web server user, check for errors.
[19:12:39] <ErikRose> Thanks!
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[19:36:19] <]2ge[> hi
[19:37:11] <]2ge[> I posted ticket http://trac.edgewall.org/ticket/7537 , I really dont like to install redmine :(
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[20:53:05] <JerMe> How would I go about uninstalling a the WebAdmin plugin after I've upgraded to .11?
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[21:30:47] <coderanger> ]2ge[: You have not provided any useful information other than "it breaks sometimes"
[21:31:01] <coderanger> JerMe: Just remove the egg, though you don't have to as long as it isn't enabled
[21:31:34] <JerMe> coderanger, how do I disable it then?
[21:31:41] <]2ge[> coderanger : ok, what more I should write ? I restart webserver, it works sometimes 5 minutes, sometimes 10 minutes, in error log nothing :(
[21:32:19] <coderanger> Find the lighty error log
[21:32:29] <coderanger> if that file is empty, it is likely the wrong file
[21:32:53] <]2ge[> coderanger : ok
[21:33:51] <coderanger> You could try to make a wrapper script to catch the output from trac.fcgi
[21:33:59] <coderanger> it is possible that will provide some clues
[21:34:05] <coderanger> JerMe: How is it installed
[21:34:49] <JerMe> uhh, i'm not sure, what are the options?
[21:35:16] <coderanger> in the env's plugins folder, in a global plugins folder, in site-packages
[21:37:22] <JerMe> there's a .egg file in the plugins directory
[21:37:28] <coderanger> delete it
[21:40:00] <]2ge[> coderanger : error log is empty.
[21:40:02] <]2ge[> -rw-r--r-- 1 www www 6768786 Aug 25 06:38 trac.opensubtitles.org-access.log
[21:40:02] <]2ge[> -rw-r--r-- 1 www www 0 Jul 24 16:31 trac.opensubtitles.org-error.log
[21:40:33] <coderanger> does lighty have a verbose logging option?
[21:41:03] <]2ge[> coderanger : LMC
[21:43:16] <prologic> How is the TracMetrixPlugin coming along ?
[21:43:35] <prologic> Can it support other RCS' yet ? (other than svn)
[21:45:10] <coderanger> I would hope is uses the trac VC api
[21:45:18] <coderanger> which means it uses anything Trac can
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[21:50:48] <]2ge[> coderanger : I cannot find verbose logging in lighttpd
[21:51:58] <coderanger> ]2ge[: Doestracd work correctly
[22:03:25] <]2ge[> coderanger : yes, it is working
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[22:06:49] <JerMe> coderanger: I deleted the egg to uninstall WebAdmin, and I upgraded AccountManager.. but I'm still getting the "LookupError: unknown encoding: /register" error, any ideas?
[22:09:25] <coderanger> restart the server
[22:12:02] <JerMe> coderanger: worked! thanks!
[22:12:32] <coderanger> you always need to restart the server after any plugin change other than initial install
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[22:18:24] <zacwhite> what do I do if a plugin installed fine from the web interface, but didn't show up?
[22:18:35] <zacwhite> as in...when I try and install again...it complains it already is in the system
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[23:01:47] <evil_twin> New news from t.e.o: Ticket #7560 (Shard weight) created <http://trac.edgewall.org/ticket/7560>
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